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Aleister Crowley.
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SARAHPHOBIA88
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 2:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sororyzbl wrote:
SARAHPHOBIA88 wrote:

And who is to say that some of his critics are not published authors?
They were and are authors, actors, religious leaders, political figures, men and women of medicine, heads of mass companies, heads of household, the poorest in the harshest of countries, and the richest in the most powerful of countries.


not really, they were mostly folks like sinclair - oh, and mussolini didn't like him much, but that was fine since he was friends with Winston Churchill. We do remember who won that war, right?

>> Let's see:
>> 1. Bankruptcy

Jesus died bankrupt, too. he had a good carpentry bizness until he gave it up.

>> 2. Drug Addict

drugs in spiritual practice have been in use since the dawn of time.

>> 3. Prejudice

a product of his times, yet far ahead of it in many ways

>> 4. Non-believer of women's individuality

"then will I lift her to pinnacles of power: then will I breed from her a child mightier than all the kings of the earth. I will fill her with joy: with my force shall she see & strike at the worship of Nu: she shall achieve Hadit."

Can't argue with the good book.

>> 5. Known as "The Wickedest Man in the World"

a compliment, it meant people were paying attention.

>> 6. Tortured (and killed) animals

no torture, but i'm sure there was a sacrifice here and there. every non-vegetarian does the same thing every day. "And, forasmuch as meat and drink are transmuted in us daily into spiritual substance..."

>> 7. Contractor of many STDs

one or two. Smile he lived long and well.

>> 8. Hypocrite (on all sorts of accounts)

not really, he was actually pretty damn true to his word.

>> 9. Expulled from religions and countries.

he just got kicked out of italy, like mussolini. the only "religion" he got kicked out of was the hermetic order of the golden dawn, which was, by the time crowley was active, more of a rich person's social club than a magickal order. never was a religion itself, though.

>> 10. Died alone

that's wrong too. if he died alone, how would anyone know his last words?


I got that list from a few biographies on A. Crowley. The information is correct. Each can be disputed as in any case.

I would just like to quote myself here:


Quote:
I do not wish to argue who is wrong and who is right. As, we will both stand strong in our beliefs and our opinions. As though we have the right and the freedom to do so.


Enough said.
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nowherepixie
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love contoversy.
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SARAHPHOBIA88
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

nowherepixie wrote:
I love contoversy.


I just love a decent debate! Smile (And decent conversation)
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Hiram
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PostPosted: Mon Jun 04, 2007 11:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The debate has been a decent one.

Nice pic Saraphobia88. Did you know in some occult texts it is said that possession takes place at the nape of the neck? location of Daath in the Tree of Life.

Also, 88 in Nazi circles means `HH` Hail Hitler.

Regards,
Hiram
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SARAHPHOBIA88
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 12:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hiram wrote:
The debate has been a decent one.

Nice pic Saraphobia88. Did you know in some occult texts it is said that possession takes place at the nape of the neck? location of Daath in the Tree of Life.

Also, 88 in Nazi circles means `HH` Hail Hitler.

Regards,
Hiram



I shaved the back of my head in anticipation of the finding of the Seminar. LOL

Do you know why 88 is better than 69? You get "8" twice!
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I prefer S.A.R.A.H. or SARAH.
Always have...even before our friend Sarah entered the picture. And, I love her, but Beastie belongs to someone else! Please don't touch P. Monkey!

My videos: http://one.revver.com/account/show/SARAHgirl81


Last edited by SARAHPHOBIA88 on Tue Jun 05, 2007 12:31 am; edited 1 time in total
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SARAHPHOBIA88
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 12:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hiram wrote:
The debate has been a decent one.

Nice pic Saraphobia88. Did you know in some occult texts it is said that possession takes place at the nape of the neck? location of Daath in the Tree of Life.

Also, 88 in Nazi circles means `HH` Hail Hitler.

Regards,
Hiram



And thanks for such a nice debate. I really did enjoy it.
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maxomai
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 6:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spades wrote:
sororyzbl wrote:

>> 4. Non-believer of women's individuality

"then will I lift her to pinnacles of power: then will I breed from her a child mightier than all the kings of the earth. I will fill her with joy: with my force shall she see & strike at the worship of Nu: she shall achieve Hadit."

Can't argue with the good book.



She only gets praise for having a child, not a career, writing a book, fighting in some crazy war or some other conflict, etc.

All she gets to do is make a kid, and that's it.


That child is the individual unassuaged of purpose. It's a metaphor for what comes from women's liberation.
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sororyzbl
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 05, 2007 7:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

maxomai wrote:

She only gets praise for having a child, not a career, writing a book, fighting in some crazy war or some other conflict, etc.

All she gets to do is make a kid, and that's it.


That child is the individual unassuaged of purpose. It's a metaphor for what comes from women's liberation.[/quote]

there's a lot more to post about the role of women in Thelema, both from the Book of the Law, and from the Holy Books and commentaries. I love putting one example, and someone seeing that as the end all be all. It really just means that someone doesn't know anything about the topic, and doesn't have the ability to admit when they're wrong. Smile not to start a flame war, but jeez, give me the benefit of the doubt, I'm a Thelemite. I know much more about Crowley than Wikipedia does.
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Hiram
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 06, 2007 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

>I shaved the back of my head in anticipation of the finding of the >Seminar. LOL
>Do you know why 88 is better than 69? You get "8" twice!

I See.

Nice one!

and Like-Wise.. as to thee debate.

Kind Regards,
Hiram
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Spades
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 10:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

sororyzbl wrote:
maxomai wrote:
Spades wrote:

She only gets praise for having a child, not a career, writing a book, fighting in some crazy war or some other conflict, etc.

All she gets to do is make a kid, and that's it.


That child is the individual unassuaged of purpose. It's a metaphor for what comes from women's liberation.


there's a lot more to post about the role of women in Thelema, both from the Book of the Law, and from the Holy Books and commentaries. I love putting one example, and someone seeing that as the end all be all. It really just means that someone doesn't know anything about the topic, and doesn't have the ability to admit when they're wrong. Smile not to start a flame war, but jeez, give me the benefit of the doubt, I'm a Thelemite. I know much more about Crowley than Wikipedia does.


Is that directed at me or Maxomai?

This debate would be more fun for me if I studied up more on Crowley (which is what anyone should do before they jump into a debate; a horrid mistake that I try not to make myself, but I fucked up this time). At least there is no hate here, or screaming. Unless I'm missing something.

But I saw that and thought I would throw in my opinion. But, let me remind you, opinions are called "Your two cents" because that is how much they are worth. Fact is the only information you can take seriously, and it is a hardest commodity to come by. Has been, and always will be.
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Hiram
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 11:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

And then there`s http://aleistercrowley.tv

Regards,
Hiram
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Spades
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I always had a feeling Behemouth was behind all this...
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Hiram
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PostPosted: Sun Jun 10, 2007 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

And here I thought it was the Great Beast 666 AL- L this Time.

Who would have figured. Go Behemoth! Very Happy

We must not forget the role of Aiwass!

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Hiram
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sororyzbl
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Spades wrote:

Is that directed at me or Maxomai?


Oh, I think it was directed at you. Smile Nothing personal, but I just didn't like that you tried to use my quote against me. I'm living proof that Thelema is a great liberating tool for women, and it's not just so we can "create a magickal childe of the beast" and all that jazz. Hell, I don't even want kids.

Quote:

This debate would be more fun for me if I studied up more on Crowley (which is what anyone should do before they jump into a debate; a horrid mistake that I try not to make myself, but I fucked up this time). At least there is no hate here, or screaming. Unless I'm missing something.

But I saw that and thought I would throw in my opinion. But, let me remind you, opinions are called "Your two cents" because that is how much they are worth. Fact is the only information you can take seriously, and it is a hardest commodity to come by. Has been, and always will be.


Very true. I just threw a quote from Liber AL that I felt would back up my argument, I could have just as easily quoted "every woman is a star" by Crowley, or other bits of Liber AL regarding the Scarlet Woman. I also could have chosen a much better quote.

The funny thing is that most of what people reference in saying that Crowley was misogynist is stuff he said about his exes. Smile Especially Rose, he was NASTY to her.
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Hiram
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PostPosted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 10:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

93`s sororyzbl,

Not to say that children are for everyone, they are`nt.
It takes a great deal of patience, time, nurturing, and love.
However, I have found personally that having children
is a BleSsing, and it has been by far the most rewarding experience
life can give. I love kids. They are the future! The love they express
is pure and priceless. The Beauty of this is reflected through their Eyes/So(u)L.

As you know, Aleister Crowley had kids.


As for Thelema, Women, and their role, I have found that

http://www.the11thcontinuum.com/

Profoundly elaborates the above in a very unique and astrological way.

Kind Regards,
Hiram
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