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ApotheosisAZ
The Order of Denderah
Joined: 08 Nov 2006
Posts: 3175
Location: Snoresville, Baby.
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 Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 4:52 pm Post subject: What Order? |
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Lately, I have begun to wonder if the Order actually exists in the Breeniverse.
Some might argue that OpAphid's activity was enough to prove the existence of the Order. Op is now known to have been a rogue organization, at least within the canon. So, what's left of the Order?
There is the Hymn of One; that's all. Other than HoO, there are a couple of fan fic groups who claim to be part of the Order. While one of those may later be incorporated into the story, they aren't presently canon.
Frankly, I no longer believe that there actually ever really was an Order. Nothing in the story suggests it really exists. In fact, there are a lot of plot indications that the Order is merely a fairy-tale of sorts. Take the following example:
Jonas appears to have been able to cross the border from the US to Mexico (and back) in his own vehicle. While that vehicle may not have been registered in his name, the Watchers that visited his home before that must have the make and model (and probably the licence plate number) of the vehicle. If the Order was real, that vehicle would have been stopped by the border guards when he tried to re-enter the US.
While it may just appear to be a plot hole, I think it is telling. What seems to be a plot hole really points to the Order being a mere fabrication. I don't think there actually is such a thing.
I think the Order is a myth; it is an invention of the Hymn of One. It was created for the sole purpose of scaring any followers who might consider rebellion. It is "the bogeyman who will get you if you don't behave."
Does anyone have any thoughts on this, or is it just another crazy theory of mine?
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The Order of Denderah
Joined: 22 Jan 2007
Posts: 2586
Location: Pandaboo
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 4:57 pm Post subject: |
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So what do you think about the Watchers?
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Daniel, Ma Belle and all its inhabitants (past and present) own my heart. |
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ApotheosisAZ
The Order of Denderah
Joined: 08 Nov 2006
Posts: 3175
Location: Snoresville, Baby.
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 5:13 pm Post subject: |
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| consideration wrote: | | So what do you think about the Watchers? |
I don't think they are separate from the HoO. It kind of fits, because they appear to only have become involved in the story after Bree initially went on the run.
The Watchers are probably controlled by the Deacons and the Elders in the HoO. Lucy appears to report to them.
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The Order of Denderah
Joined: 22 Jan 2007
Posts: 2586
Location: Pandaboo
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 5:21 pm Post subject: |
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| ApotheosisAZ wrote: | | I don't think they are separate from the HoO. |
Ah HA! I found the flaw in your theory! Watchers wear black and HoOers wear white!
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Daniel, Ma Belle and all its inhabitants (past and present) own my heart. |
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ApotheosisAZ
The Order of Denderah
Joined: 08 Nov 2006
Posts: 3175
Location: Snoresville, Baby.
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 5:26 pm Post subject: |
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| consideration wrote: | | ApotheosisAZ wrote: | | I don't think they are separate from the HoO. |
Ah HA! I found the flaw in your theory! Watchers wear black and HoOers wear white! |
Possibly. However, Lucy has been portrayed as part of Bree's religion since she first appeared. She has always worn black.
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The Order of Denderah
Joined: 22 Jan 2007
Posts: 2586
Location: Pandaboo
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 5:34 pm Post subject: |
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| ApotheosisAZ wrote: | | Possibly. However, Lucy has been portrayed as part of Bree's religion since she first appeared. She has always worn black. |
Nope! I've uncovered the truth about this series! Fashion is more important than anything else!
In fact, I know what the ceremony is. It's another fashion party, with models showing off new clothing designs on the runway later.
Of course! How could we not see this before?! The Order wants Bree because people with high levels of ribozymes are great fashion designers! Chanel, Prada, Vera Wang! Everyone knows that they all have been found to be trait postive! I've got it!
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staticmorning
Enthusiastic Fan
Joined: 06 Feb 2007
Posts: 263
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 5:51 pm Post subject: |
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but of course, they would need her to make some clothing before the big show.
maybe thats what the kidnapping is about.
shes just too embarrassed to let every one else know, so she pretends to be brainwashed.
and then, while laying in bed with jonas, she got an urgent call.
they couldnt find the blue velvet she wanted and needed her there NOW to make a huge executive decision on a new fabric (because her new celebrity client needs it now!) and so she excaped via bathtub... as all high fashion designers are known to do.
wow. i got a little carried away. i apologize. |
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robtomorrow
Devoted Fan
Joined: 25 Sep 2006
Posts: 849
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 6:05 pm Post subject: |
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The Bad Guys in order of appearance
1. Elders
2. Lucy
3. Deacons
4. The Order of Denderah
5, OpAphid
6. Gemma
7. Watchers
8. The Coyboy (?)
9. Alex and Friends
10. "The Order"
11. The Hymn of One
The interests and concerns of the Bad Guys
!. Crrowley
2. Enochian
3. Free will
4. Purity bonds
5. Ancient Egyptian culture, language and artifacts ("The Zodiac of Denderah").
6.. Epogen
7. Ribozymes
8. "the eternal song"
9. And of course the all important Ceremony
Methods used by the Bad Guys to get what they want (what ever it is)
1. Stalking
2. Surveilence
3. Breaking and Entering
4. Kiddnaping
5. Drugs
6. Brainwashing
7. Murder
Trying to find any sense in this makes my head hurt. |
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ApotheosisAZ
The Order of Denderah
Joined: 08 Nov 2006
Posts: 3175
Location: Snoresville, Baby.
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 6:28 pm Post subject: |
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Excellent lists, Rob. Thanks for contributing to my research! I just want to look at your "Bad Guys" list.
| robtomorrow wrote: | 1. Elders
2. Lucy
3. Deacons
4. The Order of Denderah
5, OpAphid
6. Gemma
7. Watchers
8. The Coyboy (?)
9. Alex and Friends
10. "The Order"
11. The Hymn of One |
For the purposes of my current theory, "The Order of Denderah" and "The Order" are one and the same. Daniel did the first research on The Order of Denderah, so that vague research is probably inaccurate, as Daniel is rather ignorant.
As we know, Op and Gemma are gone. So, the only person on your list who isn't known to be affiliated with the HoO is "The Cowboy." However, he can be assumed to have been affiliated with Op, because after Daniel's capture by The Cowboy, Daniel turned up in Op's hands.
Everyone else on the list is HoO; this just leaves the HoO as the organization. There seems to be no Order.
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robtomorrow
Devoted Fan
Joined: 25 Sep 2006
Posts: 849
Location: Seattle
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 6:35 pm Post subject: |
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OK, I see where you are coming from Apo,
So why don't we take it one step further, and dismiss the HoO as noexistent as well, how about, the HoO is or was a fiction fabricated by some still unknown entity as a cover for what ever it is they are trying to cover up. |
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ApotheosisAZ
The Order of Denderah
Joined: 08 Nov 2006
Posts: 3175
Location: Snoresville, Baby.
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 6:40 pm Post subject: |
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I like that, Rob.
However, in the Breeniverse, the HoO does exist. There might be an unknown person or persons pulling the strings, but that doesn't mean they aren't a part of the HoO.
Like all good theories, this is slowly becoming a testable hypothesis.
Edit :corrected spelling.
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longlostposter
The Order of Denderah
Joined: 11 Feb 2007
Posts: 5186
Location: Louisiana
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 7:27 pm Post subject: |
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| ApotheosisAZ wrote: | | Daniel did the first research on The Order of Denderah, so that vague research is probably inaccurate, as Daniel is rather ignorant. |
LMAO
| ApotheosisAZ wrote: | | Everyone else on the list is HoO; this just leaves the HoO as the organization. There seems to be no Order. |
So if there is no Order, that would leave only Chaos, correct?
*having "Get Smart" flashbacks*
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You can call me Juli or LLP, whichever suits your fancy.
I want the ghost of Jim Morrison to come and haunt me.
Proud member of the DB Fan Club.
Shout outs to my beautiful daughter badkittyx1505, Aithne, and Lurker. |
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ApotheosisAZ
The Order of Denderah
Joined: 08 Nov 2006
Posts: 3175
Location: Snoresville, Baby.
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 8:09 pm Post subject: |
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| longlostposter wrote: |
So if there is no Order, that would leave only Chaos, correct?
*having "Get Smart" flashbacks* |
Oh, I've seen your recent posts In Character, Juli. My eye is beginning to wander away from Lucy.....
I'm thinking that there is actually a question that could be asked In Character that would prove or disprove my current theory.
If someone here who the TAAG trust were to ask the right question there, the response would probably indicate the validity of my argument.
They might ask Taylor something like "ZOMG have you seen the warrants out for Daniel's arrest?!?!?" Taylor could only ignore such a question at the risk of being suspected of HoO involvement. As she is portrayed as having mad hacker skills, she would certainly feel obligated to investigate such an inquiry.
Also, if she answered that there are no warrants, she would be answering truthfully. If she answered that she had seen the warrants, then she is HoO.
There can be no warrants out for Daniel or Jonas right now. The HoO would never want to risk Bree getting injured in a botched attempt to arrest them.
EDIT: Because my example above is flawed. I am still trying to work out the proper wording of such a question.
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robtomorrow
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Joined: 25 Sep 2006
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Lurker
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| Posted: Tue Jun 12, 2007 11:38 pm Post subject: Re: What Order? |
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| ApotheosisAZ wrote: | Lately, I have begun to wonder if the Order actually exists in the Breeniverse.
Some might argue that OpAphid's activity was enough to prove the existence of the Order. Op is now known to have been a rogue organization, at least within the canon. So, what's left of the Order? |
As far as we know, OpAPHID wasn't rogue until the time of the kidnapping in Vegas. Remember that OpAphid was the first person to say that they couldn't take Bree by force, but that she later said "The principles of the Hymn of One have failed us"?
Lucy also seemed to be working with OpAphid (the exchange in "The Human Ransom"), and she was seen with Gemma, who we know was working for OpAphid ("Op isn't mad at me. At least I hope she isn't").
| ApotheosisAZ wrote: | Frankly, I no longer believe that there actually ever really was an Order. Nothing in the story suggests it really exists. In fact, there are a lot of plot indications that the Order is merely a fairy-tale of sorts. Take the following example:
Jonas appears to have been able to cross the border from the US to Mexico (and back) in his own vehicle. While that vehicle may not have been registered in his name, the Watchers that visited his home before that must have the make and model (and probably the licence plate number) of the vehicle. If the Order was real, that vehicle would have been stopped by the border guards when he tried to re-enter the US. |
Why would they have been? The Order wanted TAAG to return to the United States, as they'd set up the plot with Jules.
Last edited by Lurker on Wed Jun 13, 2007 1:50 am; edited 1 time in total |
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